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January 15, 2013 at 5:08 pm #71435AnonymousInactive
Hi,my son is 5 weeks old.We have been to gi dr 12 days ago and he was put on neocate,he was on netramigen.He had blood in stool,never sleeps,he is never settled and moans and groans all night.I feel sobad for him,he is on zantac,and today started prilosec.I am going back to work next week and really need some sleep! lol Ialso have a 3 year old so I can’t lay down ifhe does for a few minutes! Anybody have any advice,will the neocate start to work? gi saidgive it 3 weeks,but everybody i kinow say they saw relief within a few days! Thanks so much
January 16, 2013 at 3:56 pm #71437AnonymousInactiveHi and welcome! I am really sorry that your little son is having such troubles. He sounds a lot like my son was when he was a baby. He was started on Zantac, then tried Reglan, then Prevacid. I was nursing him but he wasn’t gaining enough weight so I had to supplement with formula that was made stronger than normal. We tried regular formula, then soy, then Nutramigen. I tried eliminating foods (especially dairy) out of my diet but finally at 12 weeks old I quit nursing. He had blood in his stools before he was even a week old and had numerous tests done. He screamed in pain ALL the time and didn’t sleep for more than a few minutes at a time. So… I know how you feel and YES indeed, you need some sleep! I wish I could bottle some up and send it to you. 🙂
My boys never had prilosec or drank neocate so I can’t answer your question from experience. There may be more differences but one of the differences between Nutramigen and Neocate is that although the proteins in Nutramigen are already more broken down than in regular formula, the proteins are broken down even more in the Neocate. So it seems as if the formula change could help relieve some of the pain fairly quickly as it is easier for the stomach to digest.
Your child might benefit from taking a supplement of digestive enzymes and probiotics.
Since your little can not tolerate regular formula and has to drink a formula that has the proteins broken down in it, then it is obvious that he is unable to break down proteins. The one major necessary thing that is needed to break down protein is a digestive enzyme called protease which our pancreas is supposed to produce. But for some babies, their pancreas has a very hard time producing enough of these enzymes.
When food/formula enters the stomach, the stomach excretes a small amount of acid to activate the enzymes to start digesting and breaking down the food. If the pancreas has not made and “sent over” enzymes to the stomach and the food/formula contains no enzymes (formula contains no enzymes, only raw foods do) then the stomach will produce a little more acid, and a little more etc… to try to activate the enzymes. After awhile of no enzyme activation, the acid itself will try to break down the food but by then there is way more acid produced than necessary and eventually the food passes into the intestines without being fully broken down.
Although it can be true that the muscle at the bottom of baby’s esophagus is loose or not fully developed, and it causes baby’s food to come back up, often times the truth is that when there is too much acid in the stomach it forces that flap/muscle to open up to let the acid/food back up. When this acid/food travels over the esophagus it will kill the probiotics which are the protective coating that lines the esophagus, stomach, and intestines. When this lining is poor or not there, then the esophagus will become raw, inflamed, and painful.
Were you on antibiotics while pregnant or nursing or has your baby been on antibiotics? Was your baby born by c-section?
I have done some research on reflux and food intolerances and have learned quite a bit. Here is a copy of an article I found.
Whilst in your womb, your baby’s intestinal tract is sterile – and so its free from bacteria. From birth though, your baby begins the process of acquiring the friendly bacteria in the gut that play such a critical role in health and wellness.
How your child is born, strongly influences what kind of bacteria your child will acquire. Infants that are born vaginally begin accumulating beneficial bacteria including Lactobacillus, Bifidobacterium, Escherichia coli (commonly abbreviated to E. coli) and Enterococcus in the birth canal with the very process of birth. These bacteria form the foundations of a healthy digestive flora and originate from healthy maternal vaginal and fecal flora.
Babies born via cesarean on the other hand, receive a different mix of bacteria at birth. This comes from the maternity hospital itself, notably from nursing staff and equipment and includes Clostridium and Streptococcus.
Following birth, the acquisition of digestive flora continues until your baby is around two to three months of age with most of this beneficial bacteria coming from the mother via touch, suckling and kissing.
The way in which you feed your baby also has a strong influence on his or her digestive flora. A breastfed baby tends to have greater numbers and types of beneficial bacteria than a formula fed infant, notably Bifidobacteria, Lactobacillus and Enterococcus. These bacteria, specifically those belonging to the Bifidobacteria clan (genera) thrive in the presence of breast milk proteins and constitute up to 90% of a breastfed infant’s micro flora. They help prevent harmful bacteria colonizing the infant’s intestine.
Newborns have an immature digestive system that has never processed food. The gastrointestinal system is literally just learning to function. Muscles that support digestion have not developed the proper rhythm for moving food efficiently through the digestive tract. Furthermore, newborns lack the benevolent bacterial flora (probiotics) that develop over time to aid digestion. This explains why a lot of infants outgrow colic within the first six months.
Antibiotics not only kill bad bacteria but the good also. So if a nursing mother is given antibiotics during labor or while nursing or if baby is given antibiotics, then all the good bacteria (probiotics) are killed.
January 17, 2013 at 3:22 pm #71439hellbenntKeymasterHi & welcome!
you have found a wonderful place to research all you can!first of all I need to encourage you to PLEASE read the following link- it’s called Groupie Intro
& it’s LONG. However, it TRULY will help you! Read through it, skim through it- you’ll find yourself refering back to it again & again!
https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=853As you will learn from the link Groupie Intro, many babies seem to plateau on zantac and then need to ‘move on’ to a PPI.
You will also learn that many doctors and even ped GIs don’t know as much as the collected first-hand knowledge found on this site!the zantac dose can go as high as 10 mgs per kilo. Do NOT just take my word on this! read all you can & make your own, educated decisions!
there’s a link from groupie intro w/ zantac dosing. read the research. then, you may feel comfortable increasing the dose on your own. I can’t tell you what to do!I *can* tell you that zantac is safe for babies & the dosing I’m quoting comes from the medical field/research.
You’ll also larn TO KEEP BABY ON ZANTAC AS YOU START THE PRILOSEC!space the two meds 4hrs from one another.Look for the link called PREVACID 101 – this is IMPORTANT!you’ll also find (I think it’s in there!) a link called probiotics, brands used
if the link is NOT there, go to the upper right-hand corner of this page & click on the search button.
type in those keywords & you’ll find it.what else? I think I’ve overloaded you enough for now
One more thing, I promise that’s it
BABYWEARING!
it SAVED us!
look for the link in groupie intro!SO GLAD YOU FOUND US!
~lauraJanuary 17, 2013 at 4:44 pm #71447AnonymousInactiveThank you so much for responding.I was not on antibiotics pregnant,but my son has kidney reflux and has been amoxiclian since 2 days old,and at 3 months will goon bacrtim until he is 1.He will be 6 weeks tom.I feelso bad for him,he cries drinking a bottle andbeing burped. hopefullysomething starts to work soon.
January 17, 2013 at 4:47 pm #71448AnonymousInactiveLaura,thank you so much,I learned alot already.I think his prilosec needs to be higher.He is 10 lbsand on 2 ml once a day.Also it is compounded by pharmacy.I pray something helps him.Also when he does finally fall asleep,he will wake up screaming and has a clear liquid that smells coming out of his mouth.Did you experience this at all? Thanks Mandy
January 17, 2013 at 10:45 pm #71449hellbenntKeymasterPlease read- I know time is precious! However, this will help you!
Prevacid 101:
scroll to the last page of this post, (it’s actually also about other PPIs like prilosec, too)
https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=1936&PN=0&TPN=1
yes- I know the clear ‘drool’ – please read Groupie Intro about Silent Reflux and MSPI…I know it’s information overload, but it’s what I’ve got
hellbennt2013-01-17 22:47:00
January 18, 2013 at 3:00 am #71455AnonymousInactiveOh, I am so sorry that he is so miserable! 🙁 If interested in trying probiotics, I have heard of only one kind that is not killed by antibiotics. It’s called Florastor. You can buy it many places on line and here you can read some reviews on how it has helped children. http://www.drugstore.com/florastor-kids-probiotic/qxp208802
And here is a link to a place that sells enzymes just for infants and children. I don’t know much about them but they might be worth a try. http://www.enzymeessentials.com/HTML/pdrdigestzyme.html
I am doing some research for my sister-in-law on different types of enzymes and probiotics that are good for a baby because her baby can not tolerate the brand that we use. If I find something that looks really good I will let you know. There are many articles and much information out there as to why babies with digestive problems can benefit from digestive enzymes and I just spent some time reading some of them but couldn’t decide which ones to put links to here so I will let you google it if you are interested. Just type in digestive enzymes for baby and there will be plenty to read.
I hope and pray that soon you will find some answers! (((HUGS)))
January 18, 2013 at 8:00 am #71456hellbenntKeymastermcs30:
about how elemental formulas work- nutrimigen/alimentum/elecare/neocate:
https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=6013
Martha (& everyone!) the link to ‘probitoics, brands used’
https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=8970&PN=1
also has some info about enzymes
AND, if you do a Search (upper right-hand button at the top of the page)
using username Erinntnx
and key word enzyme
and going 6 MONTHS and BACK
you’ll find real-life use/application of digestive enzymes!
erin posts that mention enzymes:
https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=12781&KW=enzyme
Erin was so helpful when she posted!
When people’s babies get better they stop posting, but their info is continues to be on this site, to help others who come along after they’ve left.
Erin is now pregnant w/ her 4th boy (!) and, even if he winds up MSPI with reflux, she’s so knowledgeable that I rather doubt she’d come back here- she’s got it down pat, lol, after having 3 babies MSPI/reflux.
She did the TED, gave wonderful posts about it and she also ventured into the world of probiotics and enzymes. In her/her babies’ case they also needed medicine, in addition to her limited diet (to make her breast milk like an elemental formula)and her use of probiotics & enzymes- but she was able to stop the meds/high doses of the meds using probiotics & enzymes.
ok, enough! my main point was to tell you that there is information here, too, for you to research
hellbennt2013-01-18 08:21:05
January 18, 2013 at 9:44 am #71457AnonymousInactiveThank you! I need to save that link so I can refer people to it!
February 2, 2013 at 9:49 am #71590hellbenntKeymasterUpdate please
Yourinformation helps others!
Do you like your ped GI? why? why not?
you can post it all here:Looking for GI: https://www.infantreflux.org/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=660
what’s working? what’s not?
thanks!
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